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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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hello and welcome to the skeptic zone

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episode number 412 for the eleventh of

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sep tember 2016 Richard Saunders here

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with you from Sydney Australia the 11th

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of September of course we pause to

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remember those are terrible events from

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15 years ago and imposing to remember we

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also see then maybe it happens to you

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too coming up on your Facebook feed or

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elsewhere people still clinging to the

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conspiracy theories that it was all an

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inside job in the buildings fell because

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of internal explosions caused by

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explosives placed there dynamite I don't

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know whatever it's it's it's not going

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to go away which is a sad thing also not

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going away believe it or not our

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moon-landing conspiracies this is was

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brought to my attention the other day I

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was listening to the latest skip toyed

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podcast with Brian Dunning all about the

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moon landing in fact it's a special

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three-part are very interesting and I

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post it up on my facebook feed travels

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into this you know it's very interesting

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and somebody I know chimed in with the

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conspiracy theory which led to an

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extraordinary back and forth with lots

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of people about it and I want to boil

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down to it my friend who posted this

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just didn't have a shred of evidence not

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a shred it's amazing how many people

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will cling on to a belief purely based

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on a hunch or a suspicion or something

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like that but when pressed for evidence

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yeah now I'm afraid conspiracy theories

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and their proponents will be with us

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well for a long time I imagine we're

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coming up on this week's episode of this

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skeptic zone we catch up with Michael

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crews from bad science watch in Canada

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some interesting information coming our

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way from Canada about the situation

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there with

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Astra paths naturopaths naturopaths

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pretend doctors we might say people who

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can't be bothered to actually study real

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medicine so they get a degree in

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naturopathy which I seem to remember

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many years ago one of the TV shows here

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in Australia a current affair or

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probably a current affair I probably

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have it in the archive some way I'm not

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sure managed to get one of their pet

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dogs registered as a naturopath it's it

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was it was a good stunt at the time

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unfortunately it didn't make any changes

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anyway what's happening with naturopaths

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they called themselves doctors over

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there in Canada find out at the top of

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the show with michael cruz from bad

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science watch and after the break

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something a little different something

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quite interesting we have some archival

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audio extracted from video about the

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mind-body-spirit festival here in sydney

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going back 30 years well there's there

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are two clips I'll play for you one is

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from 2002 when co-host of the skeptics

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own time co-host Stefan Soyka and I were

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doing some video reports for net FM

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internet radio station we went along the

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mind body spirit mind body wallet and

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Stefan did a piece to camera which I

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have shot and produced the audio from

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that is very interesting he chats to

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people there and they mean what's the

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old expression give somebody enough rope

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it is interesting when you chat to some

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of these people and you just well yes

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give them enough rope and then we're

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going to go back to the mid 80s and a

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report on the mind-body-spirit in sydney

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from the mid 80s on ABC TV at the time

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again this you'll find that very

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interesting and later this year i think

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in november I'll go along again but

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honestly folks things don't change much

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in the new age the new age is looking

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really old-fashioned then to round off

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the show more of the raw skeptic Heidi

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Robertson with a report from the skeptic

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camp the recent skeptic camp in Brisbane

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heidi's going to be interviewing Mandy

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noble a dietitian looking into woo in

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the health industry who would have thunk

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it now here's something to look out for

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coming up in a few weeks here in sydney

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and brisbane auckland and other cities

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my cousin ben goldacre is coming out to

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give a series of talks and lectures and

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things there will be a promo I'll run a

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promotion for it halfway through this

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week's episode of the skeptics own it's

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something to look out for and shortly on

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the show are not next week but I think

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the week after we have lined up an

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interview with Ben Goldacre himself who

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has appeared on the skeptic zone but not

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for some time in fact looking in the

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archives he was on the show in 2009

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interviewed by our very own dr. AG

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looking forward to meeting Ben for the

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first time we are cousins I can't

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remember the exact link it revolves

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around the fact that we're both related

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to sir henry parkes who was a historical

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figure in australia hmm maybe maybe we

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can work it out anyway more information

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about Ben gold acres tour of australia

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and new zealand coming up a bit later on

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in this week's episode of the skeptic

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zone Vera's of you in sydney also i look

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forward to seeing you at the australian

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skeptics dinner meeting on the 24th 24th

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where our special guest will be Lynn

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Kelly talking about her new book the

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memory code a fascinating book all about

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her research into ancient civilizations

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using memory techniques in order to pass

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down wisdom and information and hunting

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knowledge and all this sort of thing

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some ties in with famous things like

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Stonehenge it promises to be an

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absolutely fascinating evening more

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information about that talk at skeptics

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com dot and if you're in Sydney I

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encourage you to come along and if you

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know somebody in Sydney who might be

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interested in this topic please let them

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know and don't forget you can also check

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out 30 years over 30 years plus back

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issues of the skeptic magazine free to

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download from that side well that's all

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from me the

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and I'm gonna run downstairs see if I

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can find those skeptics own cats there

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we were here a little while ago I think

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they're probably sleeping it's a nice

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sunny day perfect perfect we might say

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perfect weather for cats to sleep i'll

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let the sleeping cats sleep i'll tip

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tear down in fact i'll see if i can't

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find last bits of some nice chicken soup

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with some crusty sourdough bread I do

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like that sourdough well I'm enjoying

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joining me now all the way from Toronto

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in Canada from bad science watch it's

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michael cruz hello hello Richard it's

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great to be back yes you haven't been on

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the skeptic zone for I'd have to check

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the records probably a bit earlier on

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last year we do like to catch up with

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you from time to time to find out what's

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going on in Canada and what the bad

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science you're watching at the moment

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but for a listeners who who haven't

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relatively new to the show maybe what

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can you tell me about bad science watch

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what's it all about well bad science

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what started into 2012 and we were

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responding to what we thought was kind

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of a disregard of science in public

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policy so we decided to focus our

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efforts on the government instead of the

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so the end user or the educational

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component which most people couldn't

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focus on and we've been advocating for

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good science and policy in public policy

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since then we took a little hiatus last

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year I got a bit burnt out as as happens

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with these kind of endeavors there's a

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lot of work and you know person can't

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shoulder it all themselves so I took a

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little break but we decided that we had

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a little bit more in us and we came back

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in the summer and now we're back in full

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swing advocating for a good science in

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public policy I think it's always a very

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good idea to take a little break every

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now and then I got completely with you

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doing the skeptic zone every week it's a

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little bit more tricky to do that but

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it's good to recharge the batteries take

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a step back and when you come to it

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sometimes come back to it you have a

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fresh outlook or some more ideas but

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it's it's good to know that you're there

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doing something like this we have in

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Australia a group you are no doubt

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familiar of friends of science in

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medicine and it was due to them

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following them on online and I encourage

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everybody to do so that I caught up or

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brought to my attention a story now what

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you're concerned about apart from

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everything else right now is the group

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of people we call naturopaths or

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naturopaths depending on where you are

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and there is some very interesting

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developments concerning the naturopathic

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situation in Canada and

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correct me if I'm wrong I think they're

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they're legally entitled to call

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themselves doctors is that right yeah in

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Ontario are it's like a lot of different

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places our health care is managed on the

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provincial level not the federal level

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and the regulation of naturopaths kind

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of depends on what province here in

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Ontario starting as far back really as

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the 19 in the 1980s there's been a drive

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to expand the regulation of lots of

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different health professions and the

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natural paths were right have been on

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board right since we started to reform

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health care in Ontario and in 2007

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naturopaths actually gained the ability

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to be self regulated so before then they

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had actually been regulated as far back

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as 1925 there was a natural op of the

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act or the what was called the drugless

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practitioners Act which had under its

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umbrella lots of different people

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including naturopaths and chiropractors

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and that got updated when we started to

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manage or to regulate controlled ax

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instead of professions and naturopaths

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you know join the bandwagon and managed

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to convince our government to actually

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give them their own College this has

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actually occurred in couple other

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provinces in Alberta and in budget

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Columbia as well so they are self

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regulated the story of taking

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registrants just in this past year took

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them a while to get the college up and

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running but yes they do have their own

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governance just like doctors they are

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call allowed to call themselves in

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Ontario they're allowed to call

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themselves naturopathic doctors the

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province stops short and allowing them

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to practice naturopathic medicine they

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actually are just called able to put two

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to communicate a naturopathic diagnosis

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but so they're they're fully self

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regulated and and really being held

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accountable by our provincial government

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as we speak that's good to know because

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this is what the the thrust of this item

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I saw is all about now it's the

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regulatory system in Ontario we can look

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at that now it comes down to looking at

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what the netra paths put out by way of

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their advertising their flyers on their

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websites and there was a very concerning

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statistic I saw

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like out of 300 of these people almost

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half of them are in breach yeah there is

272
00:12:19,310 --> 00:12:17,130
a a great reporter from a national

273
00:12:20,900 --> 00:12:19,320
newspaper called the global mail here in

274
00:12:24,560 --> 00:12:20,910
Canada who did an investigation she's

275
00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:24,570
been a real supporter of of

276
00:12:30,890 --> 00:12:27,450
evidence-based practice and of and I'm

277
00:12:32,560 --> 00:12:30,900
really holding fringe and alternative

278
00:12:34,940 --> 00:12:32,570
medicine practitioners accountable and

279
00:12:36,470 --> 00:12:34,950
Carly weeks put together an

280
00:12:41,090 --> 00:12:36,480
investigation where she looked at the

281
00:12:42,950 --> 00:12:41,100
websites of 300 Toronto naturopaths

282
00:12:44,870 --> 00:12:42,960
they're probably at this point there's

283
00:12:46,900 --> 00:12:44,880
probably close to seven or eight hundred

284
00:12:49,070 --> 00:12:46,910
natural paths licensed in Ontario

285
00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:49,080
probably even more than that maybe close

286
00:12:55,790 --> 00:12:52,290
to a thousand and she wanted to find out

287
00:12:58,190 --> 00:12:55,800
if they were actually adhering to the

288
00:12:59,030 --> 00:12:58,200
standards set by their own College and

289
00:13:00,830 --> 00:12:59,040
there is a standard called the

290
00:13:03,350 --> 00:13:00,840
advertising standard which said so quite

291
00:13:05,900 --> 00:13:03,360
explicitly that you're not you're not

292
00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:05,910
actually supposed to claim any ability

293
00:13:11,330 --> 00:13:08,970
to cure or any or diagnose any disease

294
00:13:12,560 --> 00:13:11,340
on your website obviously they have

295
00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:12,570
their own scope of practice that they

296
00:13:15,980 --> 00:13:13,650
have to adhere to but they have very

297
00:13:18,500 --> 00:13:15,990
clear advertising standards and she

298
00:13:19,970 --> 00:13:18,510
found that half of the 300 websites that

299
00:13:23,270 --> 00:13:19,980
she investigated were in breach the

300
00:13:25,070 --> 00:13:23,280
college colleges rules it's quite it's

301
00:13:27,890 --> 00:13:25,080
not surprising at all before they were

302
00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:27,900
regulated you know it is kind of a wild

303
00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:29,850
west and naturopaths are kind of

304
00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:32,490
notorious you know it's about as well as

305
00:13:36,170 --> 00:13:34,770
homeopaths for that matter for making

306
00:13:41,690 --> 00:13:36,180
wild claims that are really kind of

307
00:13:43,190 --> 00:13:41,700
unsupportable by science and the this

308
00:13:46,130 --> 00:13:43,200
was what Carly beaks found in this

309
00:13:49,790 --> 00:13:46,140
investigation the some of the examples

310
00:13:53,110 --> 00:13:49,800
of course that she found included

311
00:13:56,930 --> 00:13:53,120
somebody offering bogus thermography 22

312
00:13:59,930 --> 00:13:56,940
in replacement for mammograms you know

313
00:14:02,210 --> 00:13:59,940
breast cancer is a very important

314
00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:02,220
medical problem that we're we're trying

315
00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:04,170
to deal with and getting into the way by

316
00:14:09,020 --> 00:14:06,090
offering a false diagnosis is really

317
00:14:10,220 --> 00:14:09,030
quite despicable of course the flu

318
00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:10,230
season you guys are just getting done

319
00:14:14,810 --> 00:14:11,730
your flu season down in Australia but up

320
00:14:17,060 --> 00:14:14,820
here it's just strike amp up so everyone

321
00:14:18,889 --> 00:14:17,070
likes to trick the flu and naturopaths

322
00:14:20,869 --> 00:14:18,899
are no different and

323
00:14:22,609 --> 00:14:20,879
no they're right on board with the

324
00:14:25,999 --> 00:14:22,619
offering alternatives to flu

325
00:14:27,259 --> 00:14:26,009
vaccinations and treatment and again

326
00:14:28,489 --> 00:14:27,269
this is all in contravention of the

327
00:14:31,040 --> 00:14:28,499
advertising standards you can't offer

328
00:14:32,359 --> 00:14:31,050
these kind of cures on your website you

329
00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:32,369
know other things include button and see

330
00:14:37,340 --> 00:14:35,610
Oh dosing and cures for dementia things

331
00:14:41,090 --> 00:14:37,350
like that so they were really in breach

332
00:14:42,710 --> 00:14:41,100
and it's quite clear that no they just

333
00:14:44,239 --> 00:14:42,720
got registered in the last year that

334
00:14:46,369 --> 00:14:44,249
just signed up so you know maybe people

335
00:14:47,419 --> 00:14:46,379
have to update their websites I know as

336
00:14:48,470 --> 00:14:47,429
someone who runs a website it's

337
00:14:49,939 --> 00:14:48,480
difficult to keep on top of things

338
00:14:52,100 --> 00:14:49,949
sometimes but you know when you're being

339
00:14:54,759 --> 00:14:52,110
licensed you have a responsibility to

340
00:14:57,169 --> 00:14:54,769
communicate with the public

341
00:15:00,079 --> 00:14:57,179
appropriately and obviously they haven't

342
00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:00,089
set this as a high priority as half of

343
00:15:05,150 --> 00:15:02,490
them are in violation well you know what

344
00:15:08,329 --> 00:15:05,160
it's an interesting thing because and we

345
00:15:09,769 --> 00:15:08,339
get the same sort of event happening

346
00:15:11,660 --> 00:15:09,779
here in Australia with a group called

347
00:15:13,730 --> 00:15:11,670
homeopathy plus who were a couple of

348
00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:13,740
years ago taken to the court by the

349
00:15:18,889 --> 00:15:16,410
government and find a huge amount of

350
00:15:20,929 --> 00:15:18,899
money because when it boils down to it

351
00:15:22,939 --> 00:15:20,939
what these people do i'm sure and i'm

352
00:15:26,210 --> 00:15:22,949
sure the situation is the same in canada

353
00:15:28,759 --> 00:15:26,220
is they sincerely believe in the

354
00:15:31,910 --> 00:15:28,769
remedies or the modalities they're

355
00:15:34,429 --> 00:15:31,920
pushing that's why they're so happy or

356
00:15:35,749 --> 00:15:34,439
they're so unconcerned about advertising

357
00:15:37,970 --> 00:15:35,759
these things because they sincerely

358
00:15:40,730 --> 00:15:37,980
believe they work like thermography for

359
00:15:43,309 --> 00:15:40,740
breast screening and so on and this

360
00:15:46,759 --> 00:15:43,319
really rings true when we discover that

361
00:15:49,549 --> 00:15:46,769
there are some people even making claims

362
00:15:51,679 --> 00:15:49,559
about cancer and vitamin c over there

363
00:15:53,449 --> 00:15:51,689
now you don't do these things to try and

364
00:15:54,530 --> 00:15:53,459
be naughty and get away with it I think

365
00:15:57,829 --> 00:15:54,540
you do these things because you

366
00:15:59,059 --> 00:15:57,839
sincerely believe that they work yeah

367
00:16:01,400 --> 00:15:59,069
that's absolutely true for the pro from

368
00:16:03,889 --> 00:16:01,410
the practitioners point of view I mean

369
00:16:06,049 --> 00:16:03,899
it's it's once you become under what's

370
00:16:08,569 --> 00:16:06,059
become publicly or excuse me

371
00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:08,579
provincially regulated there is a higher

372
00:16:15,460 --> 00:16:11,730
standard and when it comes to important

373
00:16:19,509 --> 00:16:15,470
public health things like vaccinations

374
00:16:21,439 --> 00:16:19,519
the province comes down pretty hard on

375
00:16:23,059 --> 00:16:21,449
Colleges when they can try to

376
00:16:24,679 --> 00:16:23,069
communicate their messages for example

377
00:16:28,850 --> 00:16:24,689
in the case of naturopaths they are

378
00:16:30,860 --> 00:16:28,860
prohibited from having any kind of

379
00:16:32,780 --> 00:16:30,870
anti-vaccination message on their

380
00:16:34,430 --> 00:16:32,790
websites the the college itself

381
00:16:36,230 --> 00:16:34,440
has a very firm policy and I'm quoting

382
00:16:37,730 --> 00:16:36,240
the article now that says quote there

383
00:16:40,130 --> 00:16:37,740
are no known alternatives to

384
00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:40,140
vaccinations and no and a member should

385
00:16:45,050 --> 00:16:42,810
offer no alternative therapy that's very

386
00:16:47,900 --> 00:16:45,060
clear unequivocal of course we've had a

387
00:16:50,930 --> 00:16:47,910
problem here in Canada and and actually

388
00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:50,940
I'm sure you guys have in in Australia

389
00:16:56,540 --> 00:16:54,450
with with the doctor Goldman golden dr.

390
00:16:59,090 --> 00:16:56,550
golden who is offering homie a

391
00:17:01,910 --> 00:16:59,100
prophylaxis right dr. isaac golden youth

392
00:17:03,050 --> 00:17:01,920
dr. yeah dr. isaac goin he and we have

393
00:17:04,490 --> 00:17:03,060
their apprentice a practitioner in the

394
00:17:07,010 --> 00:17:04,500
US as well as been offering these things

395
00:17:08,840 --> 00:17:07,020
well there they happen they sell no

396
00:17:10,550 --> 00:17:08,850
sodes homeopathic know so it's in Canada

397
00:17:12,860 --> 00:17:10,560
as well that science watch was on the

398
00:17:15,770 --> 00:17:12,870
was really on the edge on the cutting

399
00:17:17,960 --> 00:17:15,780
edge of doing a public campaign despite

400
00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:17,970
the fact that public health agencies in

401
00:17:22,760 --> 00:17:21,050
BC and Alberta as well as different

402
00:17:25,250 --> 00:17:22,770
professional organizations have been

403
00:17:27,070 --> 00:17:25,260
calling on the government to ban or two

404
00:17:29,120 --> 00:17:27,080
to label these products as not

405
00:17:30,920 --> 00:17:29,130
alternatives to vaccination finally bad

406
00:17:33,140 --> 00:17:30,930
science watch sort of pushed the push

407
00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:33,150
the a idea over the edge and we got the

408
00:17:38,690 --> 00:17:37,410
we got the labels changed but that

409
00:17:41,990 --> 00:17:38,700
doesn't stop them from keeping to

410
00:17:44,570 --> 00:17:42,000
keeping making these claims and once

411
00:17:48,470 --> 00:17:44,580
again we see the college really holding

412
00:17:50,780 --> 00:17:48,480
up a very important pillar in public

413
00:17:52,220 --> 00:17:50,790
health that of promoting vaccinations

414
00:17:54,590 --> 00:17:52,230
and their members are really just

415
00:17:57,020 --> 00:17:54,600
ignoring it the for many years it's

416
00:18:01,280 --> 00:17:57,030
funny when I get involved in science

417
00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:01,290
advocacy uh in late 2000s 2008-2009 this

418
00:18:03,860 --> 00:18:02,610
the idea of a naturopathic and

419
00:18:06,350 --> 00:18:03,870
homeopathic college had already been

420
00:18:08,360 --> 00:18:06,360
done they were done you know in 2007

421
00:18:10,910 --> 00:18:08,370
when they passed the act but everyone

422
00:18:12,890 --> 00:18:10,920
was everybody knows who I was call these

423
00:18:14,660 --> 00:18:12,900
with we're just up in arms of how could

424
00:18:17,030 --> 00:18:14,670
we how could we give these people

425
00:18:18,980 --> 00:18:17,040
legitimacy you know having a college

426
00:18:22,370 --> 00:18:18,990
basically gives you the stamp of

427
00:18:24,350 --> 00:18:22,380
approval from in the public's eye at

428
00:18:25,820 --> 00:18:24,360
least from the province and certainly

429
00:18:26,750 --> 00:18:25,830
the organizations that represented the

430
00:18:28,610 --> 00:18:26,760
professional organizations that

431
00:18:30,410 --> 00:18:28,620
represent naturopaths and homeopaths

432
00:18:32,180 --> 00:18:30,420
their idea was to get legitimacy through

433
00:18:33,620 --> 00:18:32,190
college that's why they wanted it now a

434
00:18:35,510 --> 00:18:33,630
college doesn't exist to give anybody

435
00:18:38,150 --> 00:18:35,520
legitimacy it exists to protect the

436
00:18:43,700 --> 00:18:38,160
public that's its number one and really

437
00:18:46,130 --> 00:18:43,710
sole purpose and they should be aware

438
00:18:47,750 --> 00:18:46,140
that the college is not going

439
00:18:49,130 --> 00:18:47,760
stop from protecting the public when

440
00:18:54,950 --> 00:18:49,140
they make these kind of dubious claims

441
00:18:57,790 --> 00:18:54,960
and even though we cringe at the thought

442
00:19:00,380 --> 00:18:57,800
of any kind of legitimacy given to these

443
00:19:03,110 --> 00:19:00,390
professions because of their lack of any

444
00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:03,120
kind of scientific basis this these

445
00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:05,850
colleges I'm convinced or have a hidden

446
00:19:11,720 --> 00:19:09,170
blessing and that's that they are a

447
00:19:13,820 --> 00:19:11,730
physical body that we can go to and make

448
00:19:15,770 --> 00:19:13,830
these kind of complaints too and they

449
00:19:17,720 --> 00:19:15,780
have a they're accountable the province

450
00:19:20,170 --> 00:19:17,730
this happened with our physicians

451
00:19:23,030 --> 00:19:20,180
college here in Ontario there was some

452
00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:23,040
not malfeasance but the the the college

453
00:19:25,910 --> 00:19:24,450
had not been run well for a couple years

454
00:19:30,320 --> 00:19:25,920
and the province stepped in and took

455
00:19:31,460 --> 00:19:30,330
over and they started until the the

456
00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:31,470
College of Physicians could get their

457
00:19:36,830 --> 00:19:33,570
act together this was several years ago

458
00:19:38,150 --> 00:19:36,840
10 10 or 15 years ago well the

459
00:19:41,060 --> 00:19:38,160
physicians got their act together the

460
00:19:46,910 --> 00:19:41,070
province took over and I am sure that if

461
00:19:48,830 --> 00:19:46,920
the College cannot properly maintained

462
00:19:51,830 --> 00:19:48,840
or licensed their members then the

463
00:19:54,830 --> 00:19:51,840
province will have no recourse but to

464
00:19:56,240 --> 00:19:54,840
step in and say now hold on a second you

465
00:19:59,150 --> 00:19:56,250
have to stop this practice and start

466
00:20:00,830 --> 00:19:59,160
discipline people for this and they're

467
00:20:03,140 --> 00:20:00,840
going to find that registration and

468
00:20:04,790 --> 00:20:03,150
licensure is not all it's cracked up to

469
00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:04,800
be it's not about getting legitimacy

470
00:20:09,470 --> 00:20:06,690
it's about protecting the public and I

471
00:20:11,780 --> 00:20:09,480
guess we can imagine why in this sort of

472
00:20:14,390 --> 00:20:11,790
situation generally speaking conspiracy

473
00:20:15,970 --> 00:20:14,400
theory start to creep in because as we

474
00:20:18,050 --> 00:20:15,980
said before a lot of these people

475
00:20:19,970 --> 00:20:18,060
sincerely believe in what they're doing

476
00:20:21,680 --> 00:20:19,980
they believe that homeopathy is better

477
00:20:24,740 --> 00:20:21,690
than vaccination they believe of

478
00:20:28,310 --> 00:20:24,750
demography is better than breast

479
00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:28,320
screening so when when the opponents

480
00:20:33,020 --> 00:20:29,970
like yourself or even government

481
00:20:35,390 --> 00:20:33,030
agencies pointing out that this isn't

482
00:20:37,340 --> 00:20:35,400
the case rather than accept that

483
00:20:40,070 --> 00:20:37,350
evidence they will still cling to their

484
00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:40,080
beliefs and then start to see obviously

485
00:20:44,540 --> 00:20:42,090
there must be a conspiracy to stop these

486
00:20:46,250 --> 00:20:44,550
natural therapies and the government

487
00:20:50,140 --> 00:20:46,260
must be in the pocket of big farmer and

488
00:20:52,250 --> 00:20:50,150
it creates a big big feedback loop

489
00:20:55,760 --> 00:20:52,260
certainly and that's not an unreceptive

490
00:20:56,930 --> 00:20:55,770
idea to the public there's a firm you

491
00:20:59,090 --> 00:20:56,940
know part of the reason that we've had a

492
00:21:02,659 --> 00:20:59,100
rise in the

493
00:21:03,590 --> 00:21:02,669
in the support for Complementary so

494
00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:03,600
called complementary and alternative

495
00:21:09,470 --> 00:21:06,570
medicine in the past 15-20 years is this

496
00:21:12,020 --> 00:21:09,480
idea that we've been led down the garden

497
00:21:13,549 --> 00:21:12,030
path or where that meant that physicians

498
00:21:16,130 --> 00:21:13,559
were in the pocket a big pharma and just

499
00:21:19,669 --> 00:21:16,140
want to push drugs you know if it's the

500
00:21:21,409 --> 00:21:19,679
drug pushing problem if drug pushing is

501
00:21:23,870 --> 00:21:21,419
that is the problem that a public sees I

502
00:21:25,370 --> 00:21:23,880
mean all you have to do is compare how

503
00:21:27,529 --> 00:21:25,380
many times you visit the physician in a

504
00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:27,539
year to update your your prescriptions

505
00:21:31,580 --> 00:21:30,210
and how often you leave versus how often

506
00:21:33,020 --> 00:21:31,590
you leave the naturopaths office with a

507
00:21:34,279 --> 00:21:33,030
basket of goodies I mean you can't walk

508
00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:34,289
out of a naturopath office without

509
00:21:37,909 --> 00:21:35,850
getting a prescription for six different

510
00:21:39,470 --> 00:21:37,919
supplements and this therapy and that

511
00:21:40,940 --> 00:21:39,480
therapy like there's not a therapy they

512
00:21:43,940 --> 00:21:40,950
even heard of they would prescribe right

513
00:21:45,620 --> 00:21:43,950
yeah plus most of them have their own a

514
00:21:48,140 --> 00:21:45,630
lot of them have their own pharmacies

515
00:21:51,649 --> 00:21:48,150
within their practice yeah yeah this is

516
00:21:53,270 --> 00:21:51,659
a big front that's that's the old would

517
00:21:55,010 --> 00:21:53,280
we call that the oldest and by we've

518
00:21:58,010 --> 00:21:55,020
seen that many times before and you see

519
00:21:59,720 --> 00:21:58,020
that when one visits a mind body spirit

520
00:22:02,810 --> 00:21:59,730
as we call that mind-body wallet

521
00:22:05,630 --> 00:22:02,820
festival you have your iridology done or

522
00:22:07,399 --> 00:22:05,640
your whatever tests they do and right

523
00:22:10,940 --> 00:22:07,409
there next to them on the counter on the

524
00:22:13,610 --> 00:22:10,950
shelf I is the the cure by this bottle

525
00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:13,620
yeah yeah absolutely I mean that's one

526
00:22:16,310 --> 00:22:14,730
of the things that bad signs what is

527
00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:16,320
also doing is trying to hold the

528
00:22:21,350 --> 00:22:18,090
government accountable for the approval

529
00:22:23,779 --> 00:22:21,360
of these of these products because if

530
00:22:25,250 --> 00:22:23,789
they can't be sold in Canada then you

531
00:22:28,490 --> 00:22:25,260
can't then the natural path can't

532
00:22:30,470 --> 00:22:28,500
prescribe them so well we really can't

533
00:22:32,419 --> 00:22:30,480
do much about the scope of practice of a

534
00:22:34,340 --> 00:22:32,429
natural path that has been I mean we

535
00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:34,350
well we railed about this I I did some

536
00:22:39,529 --> 00:22:36,570
research into this university there

537
00:22:41,450 --> 00:22:39,539
there's a very long tradition or very

538
00:22:43,100 --> 00:22:41,460
it's been a very long game to get

539
00:22:44,450 --> 00:22:43,110
natural paths and homeopaths regulated

540
00:22:45,950 --> 00:22:44,460
Ontario and that's not something we're

541
00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:45,960
going to get in front of but what we can

542
00:22:49,820 --> 00:22:47,610
do is we cannot we can ask the

543
00:22:51,409 --> 00:22:49,830
government to be accountable to the

544
00:22:52,789 --> 00:22:51,419
safety of Canadians by the way they

545
00:22:55,039 --> 00:22:52,799
regulate these products and I and I'm

546
00:22:56,120 --> 00:22:55,049
very happy to announce that today just

547
00:22:58,580 --> 00:22:56,130
did starting today on this number

548
00:23:00,799 --> 00:22:58,590
seventh they have released for public

549
00:23:03,649 --> 00:23:00,809
consultation new framework for the

550
00:23:06,380 --> 00:23:03,659
approval of natural health products and

551
00:23:08,750 --> 00:23:06,390
I mean I'll give you an example to this

552
00:23:12,620 --> 00:23:08,760
day the only product that cannot be

553
00:23:13,910 --> 00:23:12,630
recalled in Canada mandatorily of

554
00:23:16,100 --> 00:23:13,920
the only product we cannot have a

555
00:23:18,110 --> 00:23:16,110
mandatory recall foreigner in Canada is

556
00:23:20,330 --> 00:23:18,120
natural health products you can recall

557
00:23:22,730 --> 00:23:20,340
every other consumer product meant but

558
00:23:24,050 --> 00:23:22,740
you cannot recall and that was in we had

559
00:23:26,870 --> 00:23:24,060
a legislation update a couple years ago

560
00:23:28,910 --> 00:23:26,880
called Vanessa's law which had a

561
00:23:32,470 --> 00:23:28,920
much-needed update to the laws that

562
00:23:34,820 --> 00:23:32,480
govern pharmaceuticals increasing the

563
00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:34,830
increasing the fines and and as well

564
00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:38,490
making mandatory recall a possibility

565
00:23:42,470 --> 00:23:40,290
but what they put into the law was a

566
00:23:45,740 --> 00:23:42,480
very specific exemption for natural

567
00:23:47,630 --> 00:23:45,750
health products that they are not the

568
00:23:49,220 --> 00:23:47,640
only product that is not covered under

569
00:23:51,290 --> 00:23:49,230
this legislation and that was because of

570
00:23:53,330 --> 00:23:51,300
the lobbyists from the organizations

571
00:23:54,710 --> 00:23:53,340
that sell natural health products they

572
00:23:57,650 --> 00:23:54,720
didn't want more regulation they didn't

573
00:24:00,890 --> 00:23:57,660
want to have to be under the the keen

574
00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:00,900
eye of the minister and nor do they want

575
00:24:05,540 --> 00:24:02,970
to have to go through the process of a

576
00:24:08,810 --> 00:24:05,550
recall if they put out a substandard and

577
00:24:10,790 --> 00:24:08,820
inadequate product and so the good thing

578
00:24:12,500 --> 00:24:10,800
is there's a new licensing frame with

579
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:12,510
being put it for public consultation

580
00:24:16,430 --> 00:24:14,330
it's got science written all over it I

581
00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:16,440
think I have a feeling we're going to be

582
00:24:20,120 --> 00:24:18,570
going towards a labeling system like you

583
00:24:21,380 --> 00:24:20,130
correct me if I'm wrong but you guys

584
00:24:23,990 --> 00:24:21,390
haven't known in Australia that says

585
00:24:26,420 --> 00:24:24,000
this product has not been tested for

586
00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:26,430
efficacy and you're not going to be able

587
00:24:30,140 --> 00:24:28,530
to make claims for cure or diagnosis

588
00:24:31,940 --> 00:24:30,150
with your products anymore they're going

589
00:24:34,940 --> 00:24:31,950
to be very tightly controlled if they

590
00:24:36,860 --> 00:24:34,950
are if you have no evidence so we're

591
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:36,870
looking forward to consulting on that or

592
00:24:40,750 --> 00:24:38,490
one of our consultation committees is

593
00:24:44,360 --> 00:24:40,760
putting together a public consultation

594
00:24:46,070 --> 00:24:44,370
that is due October the 24th anybody can

595
00:24:49,610 --> 00:24:46,080
consult if you go to we'll have a

596
00:24:51,140 --> 00:24:49,620
website available that will put out on

597
00:24:52,940 --> 00:24:51,150
our facebook page and if you go to

598
00:24:54,530 --> 00:24:52,950
health canada to the national the non

599
00:24:55,910 --> 00:24:54,540
prescription and natural health products

600
00:24:57,580 --> 00:24:55,920
directorate they'll have a link of the

601
00:25:00,350 --> 00:24:57,590
public consultation anyone can consult

602
00:25:02,090 --> 00:25:00,360
we meet more people who are

603
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:02,100
science-minded who believe in science

604
00:25:05,540 --> 00:25:04,290
based policy and decision making to

605
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:05,550
actually tell the government that they

606
00:25:10,550 --> 00:25:07,530
want these products regulated that they

607
00:25:13,010 --> 00:25:10,560
want you know stronger more

608
00:25:14,330 --> 00:25:13,020
science-based regulations and I think

609
00:25:15,500 --> 00:25:14,340
we're moving in the right direction and

610
00:25:17,330 --> 00:25:15,510
this has been because of the pressure

611
00:25:20,710 --> 00:25:17,340
that groups like bad science watch and

612
00:25:22,790 --> 00:25:20,720
some great work by our national press

613
00:25:25,670 --> 00:25:22,800
CBC the Canadian Broadcasting

614
00:25:26,450 --> 00:25:25,680
Corporation put out a couple with the

615
00:25:27,860 --> 00:25:26,460
kind of damning

616
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:27,870
reports in the past couple years about

617
00:25:32,570 --> 00:25:29,010
the regulation of natural health

618
00:25:34,580 --> 00:25:32,580
products and I think it it hit home so I

619
00:25:35,990 --> 00:25:34,590
think we're looking at better regulation

620
00:25:37,850 --> 00:25:36,000
and we have to keep the government's

621
00:25:40,460 --> 00:25:37,860
feet to the fire and the and the

622
00:25:42,500 --> 00:25:40,470
regulatory system accountable to the

623
00:25:44,420 --> 00:25:42,510
safety of Canadians sounds like a good

624
00:25:47,390 --> 00:25:44,430
idea and yes it goes folks in Australia

625
00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:47,400
we have the system when you go into a

626
00:25:50,690 --> 00:25:48,930
pharmacy and you look at for the

627
00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:50,700
medicine on the shelf it'll either say a

628
00:26:00,290 --> 00:25:56,490
you stl or a you str L stands for listed

629
00:26:01,370 --> 00:26:00,300
& R stands for for regulated I think I'd

630
00:26:04,910 --> 00:26:01,380
have to check that one up but

631
00:26:07,340 --> 00:26:04,920
nevertheless and if something says L

632
00:26:10,430 --> 00:26:07,350
asked l it means that it hasn't

633
00:26:13,340 --> 00:26:10,440
necessarily been tested for efficacy or

634
00:26:15,380 --> 00:26:13,350
effectiveness or it probably doesn't

635
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:15,390
work so always stick to the OSTAR that's

636
00:26:18,590 --> 00:26:17,010
what we tell people well Michael great

637
00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:18,600
to catch up with you where can people go

638
00:26:24,410 --> 00:26:22,650
to the main bad science watch website so

639
00:26:26,090 --> 00:26:24,420
we're available at bad science watch dot

640
00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:26,100
CA that's where we keep all our

641
00:26:29,210 --> 00:26:27,810
information of course we're on facebook

642
00:26:30,770 --> 00:26:29,220
and twitter as well you can search first

643
00:26:32,150 --> 00:26:30,780
there but if you want to get a hold of

644
00:26:34,250 --> 00:26:32,160
us there's a contact mixer you can

645
00:26:37,550 --> 00:26:34,260
always email us at info at bad science

646
00:26:39,290 --> 00:26:37,560
watch CA but the website is where we do

647
00:26:40,760 --> 00:26:39,300
most of our business and we're looking

648
00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:40,770
for volunteers we're looking for

649
00:26:44,900 --> 00:26:42,810
certainly donors I mean this costs money

650
00:26:47,060 --> 00:26:44,910
and we have to get the organization

651
00:26:48,590 --> 00:26:47,070
running and if we want to expand and

652
00:26:50,810 --> 00:26:48,600
keep the government accountable we need

653
00:26:53,690 --> 00:26:50,820
everyone's support so go to bad science

654
00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:53,700
watch CA for more information there's

655
00:26:57,560 --> 00:26:55,530
the tip folks if you're in Canada I I

656
00:26:59,150 --> 00:26:57,570
sincerely encourage you to have a look

657
00:27:01,670 --> 00:26:59,160
at that website and see if you can help

658
00:27:04,460 --> 00:27:01,680
or if you have friends and family in

659
00:27:07,190 --> 00:27:04,470
Canada then I think they would be well

660
00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:07,200
advised to visit that site too well once

661
00:27:10,970 --> 00:27:08,730
again Michael great to catch up with you

662
00:27:13,970 --> 00:27:10,980
I think we do this about every year just

663
00:27:15,470 --> 00:27:13,980
to see how things are going and well I

664
00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:15,480
look forward to catching up with you if

665
00:27:20,210 --> 00:27:17,250
not in person then on the skipping zone

666
00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:20,220
probably in about a year's time that's

667
00:27:22,730 --> 00:27:21,330
great thank you so much for sure and

668
00:27:24,950 --> 00:27:22,740
thank you for the for the work you do

669
00:27:45,260 --> 00:27:24,960
it's really important

670
00:27:47,090 --> 00:27:45,270
I toss a coin hundred times and I'm

671
00:27:49,700 --> 00:27:47,100
allowed to withhold from you the ISIS

672
00:27:52,220 --> 00:27:49,710
half the times then I can convince you

673
00:27:55,010 --> 00:27:52,230
that I have a coin with two heads okay

674
00:27:56,659 --> 00:27:55,020
if we remove half of the data we can

675
00:27:59,360 --> 00:27:56,669
never know what the trip in effect size

676
00:28:02,810 --> 00:27:59,370
of these makes me feels we cannot make

677
00:28:04,970 --> 00:28:02,820
decisions in the absence all of the

678
00:28:06,590 --> 00:28:04,980
information in silence we don't care how

679
00:28:08,090 --> 00:28:06,600
many letters you have after your name in

680
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:08,100
science we want to know what your

681
00:28:11,360 --> 00:28:09,690
reasons aren't for believing somehow do

682
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:11,370
you know that something is good for us

683
00:28:17,529 --> 00:28:14,490
or bad for us an evening with Ben

684
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:17,539
Goldacre homeopathic hucksters

685
00:28:23,090 --> 00:28:20,450
nonsensical naturopaths

686
00:28:25,820 --> 00:28:23,100
anti-intellectual anti-vaxxers slippery

687
00:28:28,370 --> 00:28:25,830
statisticians the journalists daring to

688
00:28:31,090 --> 00:28:28,380
declare meets is critically carcinogenic

689
00:28:34,159 --> 00:28:31,100
let's not forget fraudulent

690
00:28:35,779 --> 00:28:34,169
pharmaceutical firms so when the public

691
00:28:38,539 --> 00:28:35,789
is kept in the dark about the

692
00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:38,549
detrimental duplicity of these

693
00:28:42,620 --> 00:28:41,370
declarations how many scientists does it

694
00:28:46,010 --> 00:28:42,630
take to screw in a light bulb that

695
00:28:48,169 --> 00:28:46,020
illuminates the facts just one talk to

696
00:28:50,860 --> 00:28:48,179
ben goldacre shining a light in

697
00:28:53,810 --> 00:28:50,870
Australia and New Zealand this September

698
00:28:56,360 --> 00:28:53,820
an evening with a Ben Goldacre is

699
00:28:58,639 --> 00:28:56,370
brought to you by think ink the folks

700
00:29:01,730 --> 00:28:58,649
behind the Australian tours of dr. Neil

701
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:01,740
deGrasse Tyson James the amazing Randi

702
00:29:06,830 --> 00:29:05,010
Steve Wozniak and many more Ben Goldacre

703
00:29:09,620 --> 00:29:06,840
will be speaking in Brisbane Melbourne

704
00:29:16,519 --> 00:29:09,630
Auckland and Sydney and to get your

705
00:29:19,700 --> 00:29:16,529
tickets visit www and I hope to see you

706
00:29:33,340 --> 00:29:19,710
at the Sydney talk on Sunday the 25th

707
00:29:39,610 --> 00:29:37,270
oh the new age what lovely new age music

708
00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:39,620
that is written by stefan Soyka now

709
00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:41,330
quite often on the show you'll hear is

710
00:29:45,010 --> 00:29:42,770
talking about the mind-body-spirit

711
00:29:47,770 --> 00:29:45,020
festival what we love to call it the

712
00:29:49,510 --> 00:29:47,780
mind-body wallet festival well digging

713
00:29:52,029 --> 00:29:49,520
through the archives I discovered a

714
00:29:54,820 --> 00:29:52,039
video Stefan soika and I made when we

715
00:29:57,970 --> 00:29:54,830
were doing video reports for net FM and

716
00:30:01,690 --> 00:29:57,980
early internet radio station here is the

717
00:30:04,799 --> 00:30:01,700
audio of Stefan and I visiting the

718
00:30:10,030 --> 00:30:04,809
mind-body wallet festival way back in

719
00:30:13,690 --> 00:30:11,790
I'm standing at the front of the

720
00:30:15,820 --> 00:30:13,700
mind-body-spirit festival in darling

721
00:30:18,220 --> 00:30:15,830
harbour and I've come here to sort out a

722
00:30:20,350 --> 00:30:18,230
few of my personal issues a few health

723
00:30:23,230 --> 00:30:20,360
problems a few mental problems and a few

724
00:30:26,530 --> 00:30:23,240
sexual problems and I'm hoping that with

725
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:26,540
the help of a bit of body touch a bit of

726
00:30:30,550 --> 00:30:28,610
meditation bit of crystals bit of

727
00:30:32,500 --> 00:30:30,560
chanting I'm going to sort it all out at

728
00:30:34,780 --> 00:30:32,510
the mind-body-spirit festival here at

729
00:30:37,690 --> 00:30:34,790
darling harbour so what is actual haja

730
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:37,700
therapy oj therapy is a basic form to

731
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:39,050
using the comfort privacy of your own

732
00:30:42,430 --> 00:30:41,330
home in your own barf yeah you can

733
00:30:44,230 --> 00:30:42,440
actually sit on and you get a desired

734
00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:44,240
effect but now I don't get off that the

735
00:30:47,890 --> 00:30:46,730
women do there are women do so yes what

736
00:30:49,900 --> 00:30:47,900
you've got there is actually what we

737
00:30:52,630 --> 00:30:49,910
call this bill Nina smoothie which is a

738
00:30:54,070 --> 00:30:52,640
special brand of fruit juice banana and

739
00:30:55,720 --> 00:30:54,080
then we add the spirulina to it for that

740
00:30:57,310 --> 00:30:55,730
extra nutritional boost do you provide

741
00:30:58,840 --> 00:30:57,320
the recipe for the smoothie your

742
00:31:00,820 --> 00:30:58,850
smoothie recipes on the back of the

743
00:31:02,170 --> 00:31:00,830
bottle of god yes it's on the negative

744
00:31:03,730 --> 00:31:02,180
model thank goodness for that because if

745
00:31:04,990 --> 00:31:03,740
I'm gonna get some spirulina I want to

746
00:31:07,330 --> 00:31:05,000
drink it in this form because it's

747
00:31:09,610 --> 00:31:07,340
actually very very tasty here we are at

748
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:09,620
the wall of psychics here outside the

749
00:31:14,410 --> 00:31:12,410
tarot clairvoyant and psychic room he

750
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:14,420
had mind-body-spirit festival every one

751
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:15,770
of these psychics here with their

752
00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:18,050
credentials of what they do you can

753
00:31:20,770 --> 00:31:19,250
check them out and they're all

754
00:31:22,900 --> 00:31:20,780
categorized by color because obviously

755
00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:22,910
they're using different chakras to ER to

756
00:31:26,740 --> 00:31:24,530
use their psychic powers and then you

757
00:31:28,780 --> 00:31:26,750
can book them in here for a reading here

758
00:31:30,910 --> 00:31:28,790
today and it's amazing the similarity

759
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:30,920
between this wall of psychics here and

760
00:31:35,500 --> 00:31:33,050
the wall of victims from the sep tember

761
00:31:37,180 --> 00:31:35,510
11 bombing in our new york very very

762
00:31:39,130 --> 00:31:37,190
similar look to the wall and the funny

763
00:31:41,650 --> 00:31:39,140
thing is not one of these people

764
00:31:44,800 --> 00:31:41,660
actually predicted the sep tember 11

765
00:31:46,750 --> 00:31:44,810
bombings in New York what's going on

766
00:31:49,510 --> 00:31:46,760
here today lots of weird and wonderful

767
00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:49,520
things actually this interruption yep

768
00:31:53,650 --> 00:31:51,650
it's called the Dreamweaver dreamweaver

769
00:31:55,150 --> 00:31:53,660
that's a great night it is I didn't

770
00:31:56,650 --> 00:31:55,160
think of it but that's what the inventor

771
00:32:00,610 --> 00:31:56,660
calls it and it's a combination of

772
00:32:02,740 --> 00:32:00,620
sacred geometry yep and sound therapy so

773
00:32:03,630 --> 00:32:02,750
the shape is a dodecahedron which is one

774
00:32:06,420 --> 00:32:03,640
of the five

775
00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:06,430
solid love them I think I recognize this

776
00:32:13,020 --> 00:32:08,050
molecule as well because it looks a lot

777
00:32:14,790 --> 00:32:13,030
like the the cannabis molecule it's not

778
00:32:17,220 --> 00:32:14,800
that you on net TV that's why the

779
00:32:18,750 --> 00:32:17,230
specially not to inhaling yes not only

780
00:32:20,940 --> 00:32:18,760
is this mind-body-spirit festival a

781
00:32:24,750 --> 00:32:20,950
place of enlightenment it's also a house

782
00:32:28,050 --> 00:32:24,760
of fashion this is the Batman look for

783
00:32:31,230 --> 00:32:28,060
the shin bio Health Products wear it

784
00:32:33,110 --> 00:32:31,240
anywhere and feel good sound therapy can

785
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:33,120
you explain a bit about that certainly

786
00:32:38,580 --> 00:32:35,970
for people who have hearing damage

787
00:32:41,100 --> 00:32:38,590
problems with theory is sound therapy is

788
00:32:43,260 --> 00:32:41,110
a very therapeutic system using

789
00:32:45,510 --> 00:32:43,270
high-frequency sound yeah which goes

790
00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:45,520
directly into the ear viral walkman yeah

791
00:32:49,140 --> 00:32:46,810
and we found that that high-frequency

792
00:32:51,930 --> 00:32:49,150
sound rehabilitation we have a ninety

793
00:32:54,180 --> 00:32:51,940
percent success rate of healing tinnitus

794
00:32:55,590 --> 00:32:54,190
the other ten percent of people say that

795
00:32:58,380 --> 00:32:55,600
their tinnitus has been greatly reduced

796
00:33:00,000 --> 00:32:58,390
what's actually going on here today okay

797
00:33:02,310 --> 00:33:00,010
we're testing for allergies here food

798
00:33:03,510 --> 00:33:02,320
and environmental yeah you hold on to

799
00:33:06,570 --> 00:33:03,520
the rope which hooks you up to the

800
00:33:08,700 --> 00:33:06,580
machine yeah hey you're connected it in

801
00:33:10,740 --> 00:33:08,710
each individual food is then introduced

802
00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:10,750
it's a reading through your energy

803
00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:12,610
levels into the food okay you've got

804
00:33:17,580 --> 00:33:14,770
samples of all those different foods in

805
00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:17,590
exact over their tubes yeah that's

806
00:33:20,970 --> 00:33:19,330
pretty good the what is pranic healing

807
00:33:23,730 --> 00:33:20,980
I'm pranic healing is the use of

808
00:33:25,980 --> 00:33:23,740
universal energy where we actually

809
00:33:27,750 --> 00:33:25,990
access the energy and we use it to

810
00:33:29,430 --> 00:33:27,760
cleanse people's chacras and auras and

811
00:33:32,670 --> 00:33:29,440
show them a way of empowering themselves

812
00:33:34,620 --> 00:33:32,680
for the use of balancing their energies

813
00:33:36,420 --> 00:33:34,630
okay so how do you do it then how does

814
00:33:38,970 --> 00:33:36,430
actually work we sensitize our hands and

815
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:38,980
scan quote on people's auras and chakras

816
00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:40,930
and by through that process we can work

817
00:33:44,130 --> 00:33:42,610
out if they're congested or if they're

818
00:33:46,260 --> 00:33:44,140
depleted and we use that process of

819
00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:46,270
cleansing and energizing we also use

820
00:33:51,140 --> 00:33:48,850
some crystals they've been programmed my

821
00:33:53,690 --> 00:33:51,150
chakras are all chakra doubt my aura has

822
00:33:56,370 --> 00:33:53,700
basically gone down the drain my

823
00:33:59,820 --> 00:33:56,380
Kundalini has spiraled he said

824
00:34:01,020 --> 00:33:59,830
non-existence I've had it this is Stefan

825
00:34:04,730 --> 00:34:01,030
Vanetta femme

826
00:34:09,149 --> 00:34:07,110
not much has changed since that report

827
00:34:12,260 --> 00:34:09,159
was made of the mind-body wallet but

828
00:34:15,899 --> 00:34:12,270
let's go back even further into the past

829
00:34:20,210 --> 00:34:15,909
30 years now here's a report from the

830
00:34:27,149 --> 00:34:20,220
ABC tv's 730 report from about 1985 or

831
00:34:29,730 --> 00:34:27,159
1986 about a mind body spirit but what's

832
00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:29,740
the festival all about the understanding

833
00:34:34,770 --> 00:34:32,050
of inner strengths and energies the

834
00:34:37,620 --> 00:34:34,780
power of crystals and pyramids or is it

835
00:34:40,260 --> 00:34:37,630
simply marketing to the gullible cynics

836
00:34:47,460 --> 00:34:40,270
will welcome at day one so we sent along

837
00:34:49,680 --> 00:34:47,470
our resident skeptic Jeff Sims we are

838
00:34:52,620 --> 00:34:49,690
here they are for a new age singing

839
00:34:55,620 --> 00:34:52,630
lesson $25 plus six dollars general

840
00:34:57,180 --> 00:34:55,630
admission great value if you're into

841
00:34:59,250 --> 00:34:57,190
this sort of thing that if you're not

842
00:35:03,670 --> 00:34:59,260
you wouldn't be here you'll get your

843
00:35:20,710 --> 00:35:17,680
oh boy again sorry give you a

844
00:35:23,260 --> 00:35:20,720
state-owned hopeless that's not what

845
00:35:24,940 --> 00:35:23,270
this is about the mind-body-spirit

846
00:35:26,770 --> 00:35:24,950
festival is supposed to be founded on

847
00:35:29,950 --> 00:35:26,780
hope the belief that anything is

848
00:35:31,990 --> 00:35:29,960
possible yeah we're doing breathing to

849
00:35:34,450 --> 00:35:32,000
help people regenerate their body like

850
00:35:37,299 --> 00:35:34,460
improve their looks and deal with

851
00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:37,309
varicose veins things like that here the

852
00:35:41,859 --> 00:35:39,650
powers of the pyramids are old hat and

853
00:35:44,589 --> 00:35:41,869
crystals they're full of energy and

854
00:35:50,490 --> 00:35:44,599
rainbows under the best things in life

855
00:35:56,500 --> 00:35:53,500
in places it looks like a festival of

856
00:35:59,080 --> 00:35:56,510
prostration teaching legs new ways of

857
00:36:01,319 --> 00:35:59,090
using sleeping bags the particular

858
00:36:03,509 --> 00:36:01,329
points I'm working here

859
00:36:06,569 --> 00:36:03,519
it's releasing any tension in the

860
00:36:08,370 --> 00:36:06,579
intestines itself I've sort of muscular

861
00:36:10,469 --> 00:36:08,380
think it's an intestinal yeah it's

862
00:36:13,769 --> 00:36:10,479
referring through to the back of the

863
00:36:15,839 --> 00:36:13,779
body the message is profound it

864
00:36:19,259 --> 00:36:15,849
apparently takes a great mind to come up

865
00:36:22,559 --> 00:36:19,269
with these things be happy walk tall

866
00:36:24,630 --> 00:36:22,569
take it all in your stride I don't

867
00:36:27,420 --> 00:36:24,640
program I don't think oh I want to make

868
00:36:29,249 --> 00:36:27,430
love with Robert Redford but I just kind

869
00:36:31,769 --> 00:36:29,259
of go to sleep and just accept whatever

870
00:36:34,229 --> 00:36:31,779
comes is the way that I do it the lesson

871
00:36:36,089 --> 00:36:34,239
here is about dream lovers for six

872
00:36:39,209 --> 00:36:36,099
dollars for an hour-long session learn

873
00:36:42,359 --> 00:36:39,219
how to have safe sex by yourself while

874
00:36:44,459 --> 00:36:42,369
asleep what is that night the extent of

875
00:36:46,349 --> 00:36:44,469
the sexual experience isn't my idea of a

876
00:36:48,959 --> 00:36:46,359
dream lover is it can be anything from

877
00:36:53,979 --> 00:36:48,969
just a really warm loving embrace all

878
00:36:59,930 --> 00:36:57,349
learn to achieve the amazing get tennis

879
00:37:02,059 --> 00:36:59,940
elbow without a tennis arm and don't

880
00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:02,069
forget your feet what's so special about

881
00:37:06,199 --> 00:37:04,170
the sandal they atomically decide foot

882
00:37:08,150 --> 00:37:06,209
bedding there were atomic a designer

883
00:37:10,279 --> 00:37:08,160
tamil any time not another target Anna

884
00:37:12,559 --> 00:37:10,289
tired it's not explosive not explosive

885
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:12,569
no absolutely not they have the good

886
00:37:16,759 --> 00:37:14,249
medical alert permitted how's life

887
00:37:19,009 --> 00:37:16,769
support in here you might see along the

888
00:37:21,170 --> 00:37:19,019
to the large support don't you spoil the

889
00:37:23,390 --> 00:37:21,180
effect though by wearing your socks with

890
00:37:25,279 --> 00:37:23,400
them well you spoiled a certain amount

891
00:37:27,709 --> 00:37:25,289
of your effect because you have these

892
00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:27,719
couple start server you know the couple

893
00:37:33,199 --> 00:37:30,690
starts gives you a massage if it can

894
00:37:35,630 --> 00:37:33,209
also they have some influence on your

895
00:37:37,729 --> 00:37:35,640
reflex area what are these things kappa

896
00:37:40,130 --> 00:37:37,739
this is cover these black points i'll

897
00:37:41,539 --> 00:37:40,140
cop I oxidated a bit this how you can

898
00:37:42,739 --> 00:37:41,549
see them or better than this one I sure

899
00:37:44,839 --> 00:37:42,749
they make your feet they're green do

900
00:37:47,449 --> 00:37:44,849
that it may go speed go green a bit I

901
00:37:49,309 --> 00:37:47,459
used to have a scare of my lungs I used

902
00:37:52,249 --> 00:37:49,319
to be blind partially blind with a large

903
00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:52,259
you can see the large hole there I can

904
00:37:57,259 --> 00:37:54,930
see I used to be short-sighted I'm not

905
00:37:58,579 --> 00:37:57,269
short-sighted anymore I said I used to

906
00:37:59,900 --> 00:37:58,589
have chronic bronchitis I don't have

907
00:38:00,949 --> 00:37:59,910
that I used to be a hyperactive I don't

908
00:38:04,609 --> 00:38:00,959
have that and that's through breathing

909
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:04,619
breathing that's new well new age old

910
00:38:09,799 --> 00:38:06,930
age never mind your age a sketch is a

911
00:38:12,259 --> 00:38:09,809
sketch isn't it this is my one trapezius

912
00:38:13,729 --> 00:38:12,269
my trapezius top of the back muscles why

913
00:38:15,469 --> 00:38:13,739
do you want to lengthen my trapezius

914
00:38:17,479 --> 00:38:15,479
because most people's trapezius is

915
00:38:18,859 --> 00:38:17,489
pulled up Paul would type II because

916
00:38:21,170 --> 00:38:18,869
they raise their shoulders too much

917
00:38:22,910 --> 00:38:21,180
either in effort in being pushed at

918
00:38:24,380 --> 00:38:22,920
desks that don't fit them or women carry

919
00:38:25,789 --> 00:38:24,390
shoulder bags a perpetually so they'd

920
00:38:27,390 --> 00:38:25,799
hunch their shoulders i'm not gonna be

921
00:38:31,259 --> 00:38:27,400
carrying a shoulder bag on

922
00:38:37,139 --> 00:38:34,380
is this dancing method New Age rhythm or

923
00:38:40,380 --> 00:38:37,149
a Middle Ages fertility dance it's also

924
00:38:44,489 --> 00:38:40,390
natural and let's not forget anything's

925
00:38:46,979 --> 00:38:44,499
possible now introducing new age food a

926
00:38:55,579 --> 00:38:46,989
revolutionary high energy from within

927
00:39:03,950 --> 00:38:58,739
basically it's a mat which fits in the

928
00:39:07,319 --> 00:39:03,960
bottom of your bath and replaces

929
00:39:11,279 --> 00:39:07,329
basically a spa bath that is installed

930
00:39:13,230 --> 00:39:11,289
in great cost and expense I guess water

931
00:39:15,420 --> 00:39:13,240
where would you be in the new age

932
00:39:19,010 --> 00:39:15,430
without it it's as if it's just been

933
00:39:24,020 --> 00:39:21,530
well tell me what is new age about your

934
00:39:27,470 --> 00:39:24,030
a shower roses well there's a new type

935
00:39:30,170 --> 00:39:27,480
of fish to share there is of course a

936
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:30,180
flotation tank there had to be and yet

937
00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:33,090
here there's no water or maybe there is

938
00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:35,370
not just not aware of it maybe it's new

939
00:39:39,380 --> 00:39:37,770
age wit free water and it's not the

940
00:39:43,250 --> 00:39:39,390
first time a report has been kept in the

941
00:39:44,930 --> 00:39:43,260
dark there's nothing like a new age man

942
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:44,940
is there in jeff's UN's is nothing like

943
00:39:54,050 --> 00:39:51,210
a new age man so there you are we look

944
00:39:56,510 --> 00:39:54,060
forward I guess to visiting the next

945
00:39:58,400 --> 00:39:56,520
mind-body wallet festival here in Sydney

946
00:40:00,170 --> 00:39:58,410
I think there should be one coming up in

947
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:00,180
November or something like that but as

948
00:40:08,100 --> 00:40:03,650
you can hear same old claptrap year

949
00:40:08,110 --> 00:40:18,070
you

950
00:40:24,950 --> 00:40:22,700
sigh con las vegas no it's not an

951
00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:24,960
illusion sigh con is coming to vegas and

952
00:40:29,180 --> 00:40:27,210
you're not just hearing things for too

953
00:40:31,220 --> 00:40:29,190
long skeptics have been wandering the

954
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:31,230
desert parched and aimless wandering

955
00:40:36,710 --> 00:40:34,650
when oh when will they find an oasis but

956
00:40:38,300 --> 00:40:36,720
just on the horizon hope beckons at last

957
00:40:40,100 --> 00:40:38,310
a chance for critical thinkers from

958
00:40:42,080 --> 00:40:40,110
around the world to celebrate with the

959
00:40:44,050 --> 00:40:42,090
brightest minds and biggest

960
00:40:47,720 --> 00:40:44,060
personalities and science and skepticism

961
00:40:53,510 --> 00:40:47,730
it's no Mirage it's psych on 2016 and

962
00:40:56,180 --> 00:40:53,520
this time it's in Vegas October the 27th

963
00:40:58,160 --> 00:40:56,190
to the 30th come to the Excalibur Hotel

964
00:40:59,600 --> 00:40:58,170
and Casino in Las Vegas where brilliant

965
00:41:03,050 --> 00:40:59,610
speakers will make the City of Light

966
00:41:05,210 --> 00:41:03,060
truly shine with skeptic stars like

967
00:41:07,550 --> 00:41:05,220
evolutionary biologist Richard Dawkins

968
00:41:10,430 --> 00:41:07,560
science education champion Eugenie Scott

969
00:41:13,250 --> 00:41:10,440
30 astronomer Jill tarter and many more

970
00:41:17,510 --> 00:41:13,260
to be announced and yes James the

971
00:41:19,430 --> 00:41:17,520
amazing Randi will be there to Saigon

972
00:41:21,950 --> 00:41:19,440
2016 is a production of the committee

973
00:41:23,930 --> 00:41:21,960
for skeptical inquiry the people who

974
00:41:26,690 --> 00:41:23,940
bring you the skeptical Inquirer

975
00:41:29,780 --> 00:41:26,700
magazine the group that began organized

976
00:41:31,790 --> 00:41:29,790
skepticism a generation ago and what

977
00:41:34,580 --> 00:41:31,800
better location for a conference of

978
00:41:37,490 --> 00:41:34,590
skeptics than a city full of illusions

979
00:41:39,380 --> 00:41:37,500
don't wait unlike claims of celebrity

980
00:41:41,560 --> 00:41:39,390
psychics conspiracy theorists and

981
00:41:46,390 --> 00:41:41,570
ultimate hucksters this is no illusion

982
00:41:52,030 --> 00:41:46,400
psyche on is real register now at wwc

983
00:42:00,460 --> 00:41:52,040
conference org at CSI conference dot org

984
00:42:02,590 --> 00:42:00,470
oh ha hi james randi as if you hadn't

985
00:42:05,290 --> 00:42:02,600
already guessed I've got a wonderful

986
00:42:07,600 --> 00:42:05,300
leaflet here it's titled the conference

987
00:42:11,800 --> 00:42:07,610
dedicated to science and skeptical

988
00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:11,810
inquiry sigh con las vegas october 27 to

989
00:42:18,580 --> 00:42:16,370
30th 2016 and folks it's 2016 right now

990
00:42:20,770 --> 00:42:18,590
so you gotta hurry along and get

991
00:42:23,740 --> 00:42:20,780
registered ok all my friends here

992
00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:23,750
richard dawkins to G Scott Larry crossed

993
00:42:31,690 --> 00:42:28,130
so many and we've got George bra of our

994
00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:31,700
NC this year wonderful canopy of stars

995
00:42:37,300 --> 00:42:34,370
there that I hope you will be able to

996
00:42:40,470 --> 00:42:37,310
come and see along with the app if you

997
00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:40,480
do beat me there and I hope you will I

998
00:42:46,420 --> 00:42:43,850
want you to come directly to me and say

999
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:46,430
hello Hogan handshake whatever you want

1000
00:42:51,820 --> 00:42:48,970
i'm pretty big on hugs she probably know

1001
00:42:55,270 --> 00:42:51,830
but the important thing is that we get

1002
00:42:59,740 --> 00:42:55,280
to speak person to person okay remember

1003
00:43:12,770 --> 00:42:59,750
Las Vegas psychotic October 27th to 30th

1004
00:43:27,210 --> 00:43:16,740
it's the raw skeptic report with ID

1005
00:43:31,559 --> 00:43:27,220
robertson i'm here with mandy noble and

1006
00:43:33,839 --> 00:43:31,569
skeptic amp 2016 in brisbane and Mandy's

1007
00:43:36,240 --> 00:43:33,849
just given a very interesting talk Mandy

1008
00:43:38,819 --> 00:43:36,250
tell the listeners who you are and what

1009
00:43:41,339 --> 00:43:38,829
you're doing here I'm a student

1010
00:43:43,950 --> 00:43:41,349
dietician I do have a background in

1011
00:43:46,829 --> 00:43:43,960
science and I can't escape to camp today

1012
00:43:50,309 --> 00:43:46,839
to talk to people about woo in the

1013
00:43:53,599 --> 00:43:50,319
health industry and the unknown

1014
00:43:56,010 --> 00:43:53,609
evidence-based practice of qualified

1015
00:43:58,890 --> 00:43:56,020
health professionals and how they can

1016
00:44:01,079 --> 00:43:58,900
act against that if they if they see it

1017
00:44:02,700 --> 00:44:01,089
on the internet or experience any went

1018
00:44:05,010 --> 00:44:02,710
either way how they can put in a

1019
00:44:09,359 --> 00:44:05,020
complaint and some real practical tips

1020
00:44:13,410 --> 00:44:09,369
on how to do that yes you you mentioned

1021
00:44:16,230 --> 00:44:13,420
in your talk the steps to take when you

1022
00:44:18,720 --> 00:44:16,240
see a pseudo-scientific claim can you

1023
00:44:21,660 --> 00:44:18,730
take us through those steps so this

1024
00:44:24,059 --> 00:44:21,670
faucet basic steps so first of all you

1025
00:44:25,620 --> 00:44:24,069
need to establish whether the person is

1026
00:44:28,290 --> 00:44:25,630
claiming to be a health professional is

1027
00:44:29,609 --> 00:44:28,300
what they claim are they registered or

1028
00:44:32,670 --> 00:44:29,619
are they credentialed through a

1029
00:44:34,650 --> 00:44:32,680
self-regulation body once you've done

1030
00:44:37,380 --> 00:44:34,660
that you can use our website like

1031
00:44:39,720 --> 00:44:37,390
archive is and you can archive what

1032
00:44:41,359 --> 00:44:39,730
they've put on the internet or if it's a

1033
00:44:45,270 --> 00:44:41,369
leaflet or something you can take that

1034
00:44:47,370 --> 00:44:45,280
evidence with you the next thing to do

1035
00:44:50,250 --> 00:44:47,380
is to find their code of practice or

1036
00:44:53,550 --> 00:44:50,260
code of conduct and undoubtedly you'll

1037
00:44:56,010 --> 00:44:53,560
find where they have contravened are

1038
00:44:59,040 --> 00:44:56,020
encoded contact and the three places are

1039
00:45:01,620 --> 00:44:59,050
usually find is their operating outside

1040
00:45:03,030 --> 00:45:01,630
of their scope of practice they're using

1041
00:45:05,370 --> 00:45:03,040
the second one will be that they're

1042
00:45:07,589 --> 00:45:05,380
using non evidence-based practice and

1043
00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:07,599
the third one which is really important

1044
00:45:10,829 --> 00:45:08,770
because a lot of people do this is

1045
00:45:12,660 --> 00:45:10,839
they're using patient testimonials and

1046
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:12,670
that is against the code of practice for

1047
00:45:18,660 --> 00:45:16,450
all health professionals so you can then

1048
00:45:21,450 --> 00:45:18,670
put those together so I just usually do

1049
00:45:24,810 --> 00:45:21,460
a really simple complaint I just list

1050
00:45:26,970 --> 00:45:24,820
the code that's been offended and then

1051
00:45:28,650 --> 00:45:26,980
or they've gone against and I just put

1052
00:45:31,370 --> 00:45:28,660
my little evidence right next to it and

1053
00:45:34,470 --> 00:45:31,380
I send that off to their regulator and

1054
00:45:36,780 --> 00:45:34,480
what kind of a response have you got

1055
00:45:40,080 --> 00:45:36,790
from the regulators in general are they

1056
00:45:41,760 --> 00:45:40,090
are quite willing to act on your

1057
00:45:44,250 --> 00:45:41,770
complaints or what experience of your

1058
00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:44,260
head my experience actually has been

1059
00:45:49,770 --> 00:45:47,650
that it's been quite quick both in first

1060
00:45:51,660 --> 00:45:49,780
recognizing so just recognizing that

1061
00:45:54,450 --> 00:45:51,670
they've received it and the second one

1062
00:45:56,790 --> 00:45:54,460
is getting to the end to a solution and

1063
00:45:59,370 --> 00:45:56,800
I think that that's because you're

1064
00:46:01,350 --> 00:45:59,380
giving the regulator the evidence that

1065
00:46:04,530 --> 00:46:01,360
they can then use your kind of doing the

1066
00:46:06,330 --> 00:46:04,540
work for them but also you've presented

1067
00:46:08,910 --> 00:46:06,340
them with the evidence that you have and

1068
00:46:11,190 --> 00:46:08,920
you always have that the onus is on them

1069
00:46:13,740 --> 00:46:11,200
to do something that's what they're paid

1070
00:46:15,840 --> 00:46:13,750
for if they don't and that health

1071
00:46:17,610 --> 00:46:15,850
professional does cause harm they know

1072
00:46:21,060 --> 00:46:17,620
that you have your evidence that you

1073
00:46:23,540 --> 00:46:21,070
brought this to their attention and what

1074
00:46:26,010 --> 00:46:23,550
can you do if the regulatory body

1075
00:46:28,590 --> 00:46:26,020
doesn't act in in what you think is a

1076
00:46:34,980 --> 00:46:28,600
reasonable manner what who do you go to

1077
00:46:37,950 --> 00:46:34,990
then it's it's really difficult I would

1078
00:46:41,790 --> 00:46:37,960
say that I haven't experienced that yet

1079
00:46:45,990 --> 00:46:41,800
but I think continuing to collect the

1080
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:46,000
evidence a lot of these codes of conduct

1081
00:46:51,930 --> 00:46:48,090
in that some of them are also actually

1082
00:46:54,180 --> 00:46:51,940
criminal offenses so you can contact I

1083
00:46:56,280 --> 00:46:54,190
suppose EA Triple C or something like

1084
00:46:59,460 --> 00:46:56,290
that if someone's being using misleading

1085
00:47:01,410 --> 00:46:59,470
advertising and they seem to sometimes

1086
00:47:03,720 --> 00:47:01,420
have a little bit more clout than some

1087
00:47:06,210 --> 00:47:03,730
of the regulators so there are options

1088
00:47:08,090 --> 00:47:06,220
but I'm also talking to other skeptics

1089
00:47:10,800 --> 00:47:08,100
and maybe getting a bit of group action

1090
00:47:12,810 --> 00:47:10,810
going so that other people can start

1091
00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:12,820
talking about their experience with the

1092
00:47:19,320 --> 00:47:15,690
same professional or unprofessional

1093
00:47:22,470 --> 00:47:19,330
behaving professional what profession in

1094
00:47:25,350 --> 00:47:22,480
particular have you seen using patient

1095
00:47:31,320 --> 00:47:25,360
testimonials a lot I've seen a lot of

1096
00:47:34,410 --> 00:47:31,330
GPS and doctors you know using so when

1097
00:47:36,510 --> 00:47:34,420
people jump out of this own scope of

1098
00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:36,520
practice and practice something that

1099
00:47:41,010 --> 00:47:38,770
they're not qualified in it is almost

1100
00:47:45,830 --> 00:47:41,020
always or very frequently i should say

1101
00:47:49,110 --> 00:47:45,840
diet and nutrition and so unless you're

1102
00:47:51,750 --> 00:47:49,120
a dietitian in you're not really

1103
00:47:55,980 --> 00:47:51,760
qualified to give diets for people who

1104
00:48:00,320 --> 00:47:55,990
are not the healthy and well so you will

1105
00:48:02,490 --> 00:48:00,330
see I've seen a lot of doctors and

1106
00:48:05,790 --> 00:48:02,500
specialists medical professionals

1107
00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:05,800
putting on their websites diets and

1108
00:48:11,730 --> 00:48:08,410
including testimonials from patients

1109
00:48:13,890 --> 00:48:11,740
about how they've fed using those diets

1110
00:48:16,830 --> 00:48:13,900
you said something else really

1111
00:48:19,710 --> 00:48:16,840
interesting in the talk about health

1112
00:48:24,240 --> 00:48:19,720
professionals using their qualifications

1113
00:48:27,600 --> 00:48:24,250
to lend legitimacy to what you called an

1114
00:48:29,340 --> 00:48:27,610
integrative or holistic approach or

1115
00:48:32,130 --> 00:48:29,350
first of all tell us what your bugbear

1116
00:48:33,810 --> 00:48:32,140
is about the word holistic a lot of

1117
00:48:37,440 --> 00:48:33,820
health gurus like I'm qualified

1118
00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:37,450
professionals will say I'm a holistic

1119
00:48:41,730 --> 00:48:39,850
person practitioner I have a more

1120
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:41,740
holistic approach than a medical person

1121
00:48:46,530 --> 00:48:43,930
but it's actually completely the

1122
00:48:49,080 --> 00:48:46,540
opposite and I can only really mostly

1123
00:48:51,780 --> 00:48:49,090
speak for Dietetics because that's what

1124
00:48:54,030 --> 00:48:51,790
I'm trained in but we have a really

1125
00:48:55,680 --> 00:48:54,040
holistic approach where we consider

1126
00:48:58,140 --> 00:48:55,690
everything about the person and that's

1127
00:49:01,200 --> 00:48:58,150
why there's not just one diet this

1128
00:49:03,780 --> 00:49:01,210
dietary guidelines and you know takes in

1129
00:49:05,340 --> 00:49:03,790
people's cultural differences tasting

1130
00:49:07,770 --> 00:49:05,350
people's budget differences and people's

1131
00:49:09,840 --> 00:49:07,780
preferences I really believe that the

1132
00:49:12,840 --> 00:49:09,850
holistic term belongs with the true

1133
00:49:14,370 --> 00:49:12,850
health professionals and should be taken

1134
00:49:17,040 --> 00:49:14,380
away from those people who are issuing

1135
00:49:19,560 --> 00:49:17,050
out diet plans it's the kind of word

1136
00:49:21,780 --> 00:49:19,570
that has been hijacked by the word crowd

1137
00:49:24,390 --> 00:49:21,790
isn't it much like in the field of

1138
00:49:28,200 --> 00:49:24,400
vaccination we come across this informed

1139
00:49:31,020 --> 00:49:28,210
consent which has been hijacked by them

1140
00:49:34,170 --> 00:49:31,030
as well there was one particular slide

1141
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:34,180
that you put up about a certain recipe

1142
00:49:39,150 --> 00:49:36,970
that had a certain ingredient in and I'm

1143
00:49:41,280 --> 00:49:39,160
sure you know the one I'm talking about

1144
00:49:45,060 --> 00:49:41,290
could you tell the listeners what that

1145
00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:45,070
was so it was a recipe for bone broth

1146
00:49:53,460 --> 00:49:49,090
baby custard as delicious as that sounds

1147
00:49:56,520 --> 00:49:53,470
and it did have a raw cream or raw milk

1148
00:49:59,670 --> 00:49:56,530
in it a royal raw dairy product and that

1149
00:50:01,710 --> 00:49:59,680
is really quite alarming to me as a

1150
00:50:05,130 --> 00:50:01,720
dietitian because dietitians do know

1151
00:50:07,110 --> 00:50:05,140
quite a bit about food safety and you

1152
00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:07,120
know raw milk is not a safe thing to be

1153
00:50:13,050 --> 00:50:10,650
giving anyone especially a baby who has

1154
00:50:17,550 --> 00:50:13,060
it's more likely to become sick from a

1155
00:50:20,670 --> 00:50:17,560
from a bug or any bacteria that's in the

1156
00:50:25,440 --> 00:50:20,680
milk listeners might recall my very

1157
00:50:27,630 --> 00:50:25,450
first skeptic zone report was on the

1158
00:50:31,890 --> 00:50:27,640
death of a toddler in Victoria as a

1159
00:50:34,260 --> 00:50:31,900
result of ingesting raw milk well Mandy

1160
00:50:37,080 --> 00:50:34,270
thank you very much for joining us is is

1161
00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:37,090
this your first skeptic app this my

1162
00:50:42,360 --> 00:50:39,010
first skipped account so unfortunately

1163
00:50:45,330 --> 00:50:42,370
last year I was working but my partner

1164
00:50:47,640 --> 00:50:45,340
came last year with our oldest son and

1165
00:50:49,740 --> 00:50:47,650
it's a great thing Brisbane skeptics

1166
00:50:51,930 --> 00:50:49,750
they're a great group they're really

1167
00:50:53,670 --> 00:50:51,940
active and Brisbane skeptics are really

1168
00:50:55,110 --> 00:50:53,680
diverse so when you come along to skip

1169
00:50:58,200 --> 00:50:55,120
the camp you'll learn about a lot of

1170
00:51:01,050 --> 00:50:58,210
different actions and and understandings

1171
00:51:03,720 --> 00:51:01,060
from the skeptic community and Mandy I

1172
00:51:05,730 --> 00:51:03,730
believe you have a podcast where can

1173
00:51:08,520 --> 00:51:05,740
people find you and what's your podcast

1174
00:51:10,380 --> 00:51:08,530
all about so I have a podcast with

1175
00:51:12,450 --> 00:51:10,390
another student dietitian who's also

1176
00:51:15,630 --> 00:51:12,460
about to graduate it's called the

1177
00:51:17,610 --> 00:51:15,640
dieticians dilemma it's about food in

1178
00:51:20,370 --> 00:51:17,620
the media and food and nutrition in

1179
00:51:25,160 --> 00:51:20,380
general and we just discuss what is the

1180
00:51:28,200 --> 00:51:25,170
dietitians sort of look at different

1181
00:51:30,480 --> 00:51:28,210
nutritional issues in the media so just

1182
00:51:32,070 --> 00:51:30,490
um some feedback and but it's very

1183
00:51:34,080 --> 00:51:32,080
laid-back that sort of fun and we talk a

1184
00:51:36,450 --> 00:51:34,090
lot about food as well and we're both

1185
00:51:39,290 --> 00:51:36,460
parents so just just fun food and

1186
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:39,300
nutrition and dumb that's worthy and

1187
00:51:45,930 --> 00:51:42,850
evidence sounds good so check out

1188
00:51:48,660 --> 00:51:45,940
Mandy's podcast at the dietitians

1189
00:51:50,790 --> 00:51:48,670
dilemma it was a great talk and

1190
00:51:52,470 --> 00:51:50,800
hopefully we'll see you at more skeptics

1191
00:52:11,170 --> 00:51:52,480
events in the future thanks for joining

1192
00:52:15,380 --> 00:52:13,700
the Australian skeptics national

1193
00:52:18,700 --> 00:52:15,390
convention will be held in melbourne

1194
00:52:23,120 --> 00:52:18,710
from the 25th to the 27th of november

1195
00:52:26,329 --> 00:52:23,130
2016 speakers will include Lawrence

1196
00:52:29,839 --> 00:52:26,339
Krauss Ed's odd Ernst Harriet hall

1197
00:52:33,050 --> 00:52:29,849
Michael Marshall Mel Thompson Lynn Kelly

1198
00:52:36,410 --> 00:52:33,060
ken harvey Lara wood and Deanne Carson

1199
00:52:39,890 --> 00:52:36,420
Joe alabaster peterb outage Ross mulch

1200
00:52:42,710 --> 00:52:39,900
Emma Miley mouth vicars and more to be

1201
00:52:46,280 --> 00:52:42,720
announced be theme of this year's

1202
00:52:48,050 --> 00:52:46,290
conferences good thinking for more

1203
00:52:51,530 --> 00:52:48,060
information and to get your tickets and

1204
00:53:11,760 --> 00:52:51,540
tickets for the annual dinner visit www

1205
00:53:17,890 --> 00:53:14,470
thank you for listening to the skeptic

1206
00:53:19,960 --> 00:53:17,900
zone and if you're in Sydney later in

1207
00:53:24,670 --> 00:53:19,970
october i look forward to possibly

1208
00:53:27,940 --> 00:53:24,680
seeing you at folding australia 2016

1209
00:53:30,060 --> 00:53:27,950
origami convention i'll be holding a

1210
00:53:32,500 --> 00:53:30,070
class and how to fold the origami pig

1211
00:53:34,990 --> 00:53:32,510
pegasus the flying pig i invented for

1212
00:53:36,930 --> 00:53:35,000
james randi my good friend gary clark

1213
00:53:41,080 --> 00:53:36,940
will be there to do some modular origami

1214
00:53:43,510 --> 00:53:41,090
you might remember Gary if you're in

1215
00:53:45,970 --> 00:53:43,520
Australia and you watched the recent

1216
00:53:49,420 --> 00:53:45,980
series about births deaths and marriages

1217
00:53:52,180 --> 00:53:49,430
on the ABC TV Gary Clark was one of the

1218
00:53:53,860 --> 00:53:52,190
people who featured in that and some

1219
00:53:55,810 --> 00:53:53,870
people might remember he made origami

1220
00:53:57,130 --> 00:53:55,820
for people anyway he's a good friend of

1221
00:54:01,660 --> 00:53:57,140
mine and he'll be at the origami

1222
00:54:05,500 --> 00:54:01,670
convention to at saturday and suddenly

1223
00:54:07,540 --> 00:54:05,510
that's the 29th and 30th of October and

1224
00:54:09,940 --> 00:54:07,550
that will be held in pots point but for

1225
00:54:12,970 --> 00:54:09,950
more information I just go to skeptics

1226
00:54:16,210 --> 00:54:12,980
own TV for the link in this week's shown

1227
00:54:19,090 --> 00:54:16,220
it and while you are there I encourage

1228
00:54:25,500 --> 00:54:19,100
you to subscribe to the skeptic zone you

1229
00:54:28,690 --> 00:54:25,510
can do it for a dollar an episode cheap

1230
00:54:30,490 --> 00:54:28,700
kobe worth more than that Shirley hmm

1231
00:54:32,830 --> 00:54:30,500
anyway there's a range of options there

1232
00:54:35,500 --> 00:54:32,840
if you care to if you enjoy the show if

1233
00:54:37,060 --> 00:54:35,510
it keeps you company if you look forward

1234
00:54:39,310 --> 00:54:37,070
to hearing it every week and you get

1235
00:54:42,460 --> 00:54:39,320
some benefit out of it you might

1236
00:54:44,620 --> 00:54:42,470
consider subscribing by our patreon or

1237
00:54:47,160 --> 00:54:44,630
just through paypal the options are

1238
00:54:52,480 --> 00:54:47,170
there for you at skeptic zone TV and

1239
00:54:54,130 --> 00:54:52,490
your generous contributions means the

1240
00:54:56,920 --> 00:54:54,140
show keeps going and we can afford to

1241
00:54:58,800 --> 00:54:56,930
buy things like recording equipment from

1242
00:55:02,050 --> 00:54:58,810
time to time or get our reporters around

1243
00:55:04,690 --> 00:55:02,060
especially maynard we like to get main

1244
00:55:06,970 --> 00:55:04,700
aren't around oh if you haven't visited

1245
00:55:08,770 --> 00:55:06,980
Maynard calm day you I encourage you to

1246
00:55:11,910 --> 00:55:08,780
do so to listen to the fabulous Maynard

1247
00:55:14,200 --> 00:55:11,920
podcasts including bunga bunga and

1248
00:55:15,940 --> 00:55:14,210
recently he's had to put out a special

1249
00:55:19,840 --> 00:55:15,950
about the new australian movie coming

1250
00:55:21,630 --> 00:55:19,850
out called spit out directed by our good

1251
00:55:24,620 --> 00:55:21,640
friend tim ferguson who appears

1252
00:55:27,690 --> 00:55:24,630
the skeptic zone from time to time and

1253
00:55:29,940 --> 00:55:27,700
hands up vested interest here I do like

1254
00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:29,950
to support the local TV and film

1255
00:55:34,829 --> 00:55:32,170
industry because I do part-time work in

1256
00:55:37,319 --> 00:55:34,839
that industry but apart from that it's

1257
00:55:39,150 --> 00:55:37,329
nice to her it's nice to support a

1258
00:55:40,859 --> 00:55:39,160
friend coming up next week on the

1259
00:55:42,240 --> 00:55:40,869
skeptics own talking about friends

1260
00:55:44,970 --> 00:55:42,250
another old friend of skeptics owns

1261
00:55:47,069 --> 00:55:44,980
sharon hill from doubtful news joins us

1262
00:55:49,109 --> 00:55:47,079
to tell us the latest goings-on at

1263
00:55:51,599 --> 00:55:49,119
doubtful news and then the week after

1264
00:55:53,370 --> 00:55:51,609
that as mentioned earlier we hope to

1265
00:55:56,970 --> 00:55:53,380
have in fact we're lining it up an

1266
00:55:59,130 --> 00:55:56,980
interview with my distant cousin ben

1267
00:56:01,650 --> 00:55:59,140
goldacre who's touring australia and new

1268
00:56:03,509 --> 00:56:01,660
zealand in a few weeks but for this week

1269
00:56:11,630 --> 00:56:03,519
this is Richard Saunders signing off

1270
00:56:17,819 --> 00:56:14,039
you've been listening to the skeptic

1271
00:56:20,789 --> 00:56:17,829
zone podcast visit our website at WCA

1272
00:56:24,690 --> 00:56:20,799
pegs on TV for contacts an archive of

1273
00:56:27,329 --> 00:56:24,700
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1274
00:56:30,049 --> 00:56:27,339
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1275
00:56:33,059 --> 00:56:30,059
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1276
00:56:36,120 --> 00:56:33,069
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1277
00:56:38,970 --> 00:56:36,130
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1278
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1279
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1280
00:56:46,499 --> 00:56:44,799
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1281
00:56:48,599 --> 00:56:46,509
views and opinions expressed on the

1282
00:56:51,289 --> 00:56:48,609
skeptic zone and not necessarily those

1283
00:57:01,640 --> 00:56:51,299
Australian skeptics or any other

1284
00:57:08,359 --> 00:57:04,730
alright mr. Scott an entire